InWorldz prospers, 3DMee closes in November

The top 40 OpenSim grids have reached 29,617 regions, an increase of 912 regions since this time last month. They also reported 319,872 total registered users and 19,527 active users this month, a total of 3,675 new registered users and 1,052 new active users.

All three numbers were record highs for OpenSim.

Region counts on the 40 largest public OpenSim grids.

Region counts on the 40 largest public OpenSim grids.

Kitely, a cloud-based, on-demand grid, gained the most regions, growing by 263, followed by the non-profit open grid OSgrid, with 230 new regions. Metropolis gained 199 regions, and the troubled AviWorlds grid gained 122. Other grids gained 50 regions or less.

There were 289 grids active at least some of the time over the past month, 216 of which reported statistics. There were a total of 31,960 regions, 336,634 registered users and 22,353 active users on those 216 grids.

Meanwhile, of the 279 currently active public OpenSim grids, 219 reported their statistics this month, and their land area adds up to a total of 30,988 regions.

This count does not include private grids, such as grids run behind school firewalls, or grids set up to run large corporate simulations, or the nearly 7,000 regions running on personal New World Studio installations.

The top 40 OpenSim grids now have 3,178 more regions than Second Life, and all 216 grids put together have 5,521 more regions.

OpenSim has an edge over Second Life when it comes to land because individuals can set up regions for free, or rent regions from a number of vendors competing on both price and service at about a tenth the price of similar Second Life regions.

Total regions on the public OpenSim grids and in Second Life.

Total regions on the public OpenSim grids and in Second Life.

However, as can be seen from the active user numbers, OpenSim still isn’t a match for Second Life in terms of the absolute size of community.

Linden Lab stopped reporting active users a few years ago, but projecting out based on Grid Survey’s concurrency numbers, there are around 800,000 active monthly users now in Second Life — 36 times more active people than in OpenSim.

As a result, people coming to OpenSim either bring their own communities with them — such as schools and role playing groups — or don’t need communities, such as independent builders and creators.

Popularity

For company and school grids, relative popularity is not an issue — the grids are set up for a specific purpose, and if they meet that purpose, then they are successful. The same is true for grids run by niche communities or that serve a special purpose not found elsewhere.

But when it comes to general-purpose social grids, the rule of thumb is: the bigger and busier, the better. People looking to make new friends look for grids that already have the most users. Merchants looking to sell content will go to the grids with the most potential customers. Event organizers looking for the biggest audience… you get the idea.

With that in mind, here are the 10 most popular grids this month:

InWorldz was the big gainer this month, with 1,028 more active users than a month ago, dwarfing the gains on all other grids.

According to InWorldz co-founder and CTO David Daeschler, the increase could be attributed to a number of factors, such as the launch of full LSL vehicle support on top of the grid’s existing Nvidia PhysX-based physics, the launch of the Zephyr wind module offering realistic wind direction and speed, all capped off by a Relay for Life event which raised around $1,600 for the cancer charity.

The hypergrid-enabled Spanish-language MitaKa grid — at 44 regions, too small to make our 40 largest grids list or our most popular list — gained 116 new users, for a total of 174 active users this month. Another big gainer was Kitely, with 110 new users, followed by 73 new users on Metropolis. Another small grid, Islands of Enlightenment, an educational grid serving students in western New York state, gained 66 new active users, for a new total of 73 actives.

The biggest losers this month were Island Oasis, which fell by 150 active users, and OSgrid, which lost 98 actives.

News from around the grids

There was a lot of turmoil on the grids this month, with new grids popping up and old ones disappearing.

The troubled AviWorlds grid looked like it was out for the count — again — with controversial owner Alex Ferraris emailing grid residents that he had tried and tried, and failed for the last time, and had nothing left in him to try again. Then, a couple of days letter, a follow-up email said that he was just dealing with some personal issues, and making some administrative changes and not closing the grid after all.

Meanwhile, two weeks ago, in a comment on Hypergrid Business, AviWorlds founder Alex Ferraris said that hypergrid connectivity will be turned off, residents will no longer be able to connect self-hosted regions, and content-stealing “copybot” viewers will be banned from the grid. Then, earlier this week, Ferraris announced that hypergrid connectivity will be turned back on.

Despite the turmoil — or perhaps because of it — the grid continues to attract users and region renters. Most recently, Mike Hart of Pro Racer fame has brought automobile racing to the grid, in the form of a 16-region motorsports complex.

One grid that has definitely shutting down is 3DMee, which posted an announcement on the members-only area of its website that it is closing as of November 18.

“It’s been a tremendous effort and stellar fun, too,” a grid admin posted earlier this month. “But this doesn’t mean we won’t be back with something different or better in the future. Who knows?”

The grid will be refunding the balance of region rental fees for any regions paid up past the closing date.

3DMee was run by Taiwan-based 3DX, a virtual world development company run by Steve Sima, also known as Sakai OpenLife. The company is best-known for its OpenLife Grid, founded in 2007. OpenLife became 3DMee in September of 2011.

Commuinity Island on 3DMee by Danko Whitfield

Community Island region on 3DMee grid. (Image courtesy Danko Whitfield.)

There was no word as to whether current users will be able to export either their regions or their inventories before the grid closes.

Typically, when commercial grids close, much of the content is lost unless users save it one individual item at a time. Commercial grids usually do not allow OAR region exports or IAR inventory exports in order to attract merchants worried about content protection.

Another major grid which may also be going down is Virtyou, based in the Netherlands. We’ve been tracking the grid since 2009, making it one of the oldest grids on the hypergrid. Last month, it had 110 regions and just eight active users — down from a peak of nearly 200 active users at the end of 2011. Both the website and its loginURI are down, and they haven’t been responding to emails.

Dutch-speaking OpenSim users have other grids to choose from, however, including DWGridRaWHiDeBubbleszThoMaxGridSimValleyOpenSim.nlEduGrid NL, and 3DLES. The last four are part of a Dutch educational collaborative project and are hosted by Business Aspire.

Another grid with a troubled history which may, or may not, be closing is SpotOn3D. The grid is best known for a browser plugin which puts a standard OpenSim viewer into a webpage, making it slightly more user-friendly. The plugin is part of the grid’s portfolio of patents, which has been a source of significant controversy. The Facebook group hasn’t been updated since September, the Twitter feed looks like it’s been hijacked by a spammer for the past month, emails have been bouncing, the grid has been mostly down, and people who were able to log in report a “ghost town.”

One quick way to check whether a grid is down is to type its loginURI into a browser followed by “/get_grid_info”. For example, here is InWorldz’ info page: inworldz.com:8002/get_grid_info — the SpotON3D info page at spoton3d.com:8002/get_grid_info exists, but has no information. Grids that are completely closed have no grid info page at all, however. The grid may be having temporary server problems or DNS issues, which it had before, and which any grid or website can experience from time to time. But the lack of information on the grid’s social media sites is worrisome, as is the status of its pending patents.

On a more positive note, the science fiction-themed UFSGrid has launched a new social platform connected to an in-world HUD.

The commercial social grid Virtual Highway is opening its vintage-themed Boardwalk region on November 24, and its winter holiday regions on December 1. The Boardwalk region includes a ballroom, a shopping area, a carnival and a treasure hunt and the winter holiday regions will have a lodge, skiing and ice skating, a dance floor, a toboggan run, a shopping district and a snowman building contest with cash prizes and holiday gifts.

Boardwalk region on the Virtual Highway grid. (Image courtesy Virtual Highway.)

Boardwalk region on the Virtual Highway grid. (Image courtesy Virtual Highway.)

Spellscape, a commercial grid focusing on witchcraft and wizardry, migrated from AuroraSim to standard OpenSim, its grid managed told Hypergrid Business, with a down time of just 12 hours.

Kitely is still getting ready to upgrade to the latest version of OpenSim, version 0.7.6, so hasn’t started working on hypergrid delivery of marketplace items yet, or hypergrid teleports to other grids. However, Kitely Market continues to grow, CEO Ilan Tochner told Hypergrid Business, with a total of 2,500 product variations now listed, up from 1,700 this time last month, an increase of 47 percent. The number of transactions and merchants is also up, he said.

Transitions

We’re listing 13 grids as suspended this month because we haven’t been able to get to their grid info pages or websites this month, including ChatCafe3D, EnglishGrid, Homeland3D, Laboratorio GIAA, Realms of Eorith, Roleplay Grid, SpotOn 3D, Tamerlane Grid, VIBE: SCRATCH, Virtual Reality, Virtual Ryukyu, Wonda Worldz, and World-DC.

Meanwhile, we’ve added several new grids to our database, including UFGQ GridVirtual ClubGangster WarsGerman LifeMajickal LifeThe Hidden Continent of ChaxezPlanet EinsteinArdaliaGorgeys GridEvans Virtual WorldMiguelinuxNeuWaldB-ATMLost WorldZetaWorlds, and Dankoville.

If there’s a public grid we’re not tracking, please email us at [email protected]. There’s no centralized way to find OpenSim grids, so if you don’t tell us about it, and Google doesn’t alert us, we won’t know about it.

The stats page for the Diva Distro, a user-friendly distribution of OpenSim, reported 803 downloads this month, for a grand total of over 27,000 downloads since the distribution was first released in May of 2011.

Sim-on-a-Stick, a packaged version of the Diva Distro, was downloaded 943 times this month, for over 24,000 downloads total since the distribution was first released in May 2011.

Both the Diva Distro and Sim-on-a-Stick were recently updated to OpenSim version 0.7.6, which offers increased performance, out-of-the-box support for groups and offline messages, better teleports, a few new scripting commands, and support for a new export permission.

The New World Studio, which allows people to set up private grids in just a few clicks with a fully automated installer, recently began publishing its usage statistics. As of today, it reports 8,617  regions on 1,689 different active grids running on this distribution of OpenSim. That’s an increase of 1,632 new regions, and 159 new grids.

Meanwhile, according to data from The Hypergates, the number of hypergate jumps on their network this month fell slightly to 2,813. The system now has 757  registered hypergates, up by 45 from last month, on 69 different grids.

This data is very limited, however. For example, not all hypergates are part of The Hypergates network — anyone can create their own hypergate by dropping a script on any object, such as our touch or walk-through single-destination hypergate script. In addition, many people do hypergrid jumps without using any gate at all, simply by typing a hypergrid address into Map-Search, or by using a hypergrid landmark created during a previous jump. There is currently no way of tracking that traffic.

Meanwhile, Second Life continued to lose land, according to data from GridSurvey, with 131 fewer regions today than the same time last month. The Second Life grid now has 26,661 regions total, down 1,977 regions from this time last year, and 5,224 fewer regions than its peak in June of 2010. According to GridSurvey, the last time the grid was this small was in May of 2009.

November Region Counts on the Top 40 Grids

The list below is a small subset of existing OpenSim grids. We are now tracking a total of 744 different publicly-accessible grids, 289 of which were active this month, and 216 of which published their statistics. There were a total of 30,988 regions, 338,424 registered users, and 21,189 active users on those 216 grids.

Many school, company or personal grids do not publish their numbers.

The raw data for this month’s report is here. A list of all active grids is here.

maria@hypergridbusiness.com'

Maria Korolov

Maria Korolov is editor and publisher of Hypergrid Business. She has been a journalist for more than twenty years and has worked for the Chicago Tribune, Reuters, and Computerworld and has reported from over a dozen countries, including Russia and China.

  • Super Doug

    3DMEE closed down due to very poor management in regards you had to have an invite to visit the grid then they sold your E-Mail adress to porn sites so soon your spam folder filled with scams and porno[

    as for inworldz its hard for me to trust the numbers becouse all the things they have done to other grids[example my wife used to get our tiers super discounted with our izzys at 3x the buy rate but was a catch they had her with others go for weeks at a time to avination[island oasis[ to disrupt the grids with heavy drama to sour everything but other grids too it has been like some CIA operations out of movies with objectives[targets of certain people you name it[ if looking at past stats here with the times inbetween it would seem they had alot of success[

    you brought up spoton3d they sent the ewoke clan unit into that grid to undermind really heavy all along tossing the grid people a bone that they might bring the grid saving clan to it[

    last we heard after she got out of it was they were going after VH virtual highway grid[
    after 2 year’s of this we walked away now in the process of getting our own [mini grid no matter how much we saved we did not save our dignity but admit we have been bad but only thing we can do is now do good things then hope karma forgives us[

    Regarding aviworlds the guy need’s to lighting up[

    not expecting anyone to accept the inside info but just be aware more to the numbers then meets the eye indeed[

    Douglas[

    • These sound like pretty serious allegations to be made anonymously. Plus, you’re adding an additional layer of paranoia for potential grid owners. If there’s drama on your grid, is it the natural by-product of human nature, or an evil plot by other grid owners?

      If I were a grid owner, I’d go by the old saying — “never ascribe to conspiracy what can be explained by good old-fashioned stupidity.” I’d assume that people were sincere, or at least sincere in their trollish-ness, and deal with it tactfully and quietly. (At least, I hope I would!) Pointing fingers would just make me look paranoid — and, if the allegations turned out to be false — incompetent and gullible.

      Finally, in order to make any kind of impact on another grid, a user would need to be socially influential — a land baron, a big-name merchant, a celebrity performer or designer, or a loud-mouth rabblerouser. It’s too much work for would-be evil-doers to become land barons or successful merchants on other grids, and loud-mouth rabblerousers are easy to spot and shut down. The only potentially effective tactic, I think, would be a gossipy whisper campaign — and if the grid owners are transparent and responsive to their users, addressing rumors immediately and honestly is a pretty effective counter-measure. Whether those rumors are malicious or just the natural human gossip impulse.

      Finally, if you’re sending large numbers of other people to other grids, there’s always the risk that they’ll like things better over there, and decide to stay.

      If I was a grid owner, I’d focus on improving my own platform, and working on marketing and outreach. If I was looking at other grids for my new users, that’s a very very small pool to draw from. Looking outside of OpenSim — that’s billions of potential customers.

      In particular, InWorldz has more active users than ALL OTHER COMMERCIAL GRIDS COMBINED. I really doubt that picking up a few people who pay attention to gossip here and there makes a big difference in their bottom line.

      • Mortus

        I agree much more facts sould be laid out before one comes to conclusions,
        after being pointed to this forum it seems time is right to share what i know on this matter in light of privacy controls and while the other poster comments due seem far fetched it cannot be ruled out as well,

        First these for profit grids are coperations in some form or another then we all know good and well even today millions of dollars are fined to companys that try to bypass laws to gain profit so the idea becouse they are established has no binding on motives,

        2 years ago i had a friend from secondlife visited the grid while i was not online at that moment nor did i know if he was logging in under a current name or new name he had picked for inworldz, he logged into IDI as he rezzed in he was met by Ele one of the founders who greeted him and nothing unusal happened and he bragged about being treated well but one thing that made him nervouse was she referred to him as his secondlife name that had nothing to do with his current name this happened twice and with both names not the same it scared him enough that he never returned, his names on both sides very unusal this would had to be a 1 in a million error of ‘sorry i got the wrong chat’ plus i checked was no resident in the grid at that time with that name , so what does all this mean, well let me get to other facts that might explain this,

        I have a friend who used to be involved in the emerald viewer program who just happened to share one day in passing conversation something that made me ponder what is privacy if any in secondlife or any other grid, here are the facts he told me,

        1. people use cracked viewers or huds to filter data packets that can intercept peoples conversations in private IM’s , while secondlife has put heavy safeguards in place it still happens so one has to think what safeguards if any have been written in to this free code that everyone seem’s to use,

        2.Secondlife uses a residents roaming appt data file to discover someones alts when preparing to not only ban that account but all accounts related to that ISP as that is part of the super ban they use on some really bad apples,
        now what does this mean for the rest of us, well its a dangerouse flaw that people don’t know about much, when people are asked to visit opensim that any grid with a half decent programer can also tap into any new visiters roaming appt file then find out not only who they but every alt they have in secondlife or any other grid, people sould be informed about this but it seems the standards to get people into opensim are not set high or to alert to any possable privacy violations,

        my friend had explained that years ago secondlife at the start of opensim used to ban openlife grid members who used to visit secondlife by using the roaming data they knew who they were then banned the account related,below is the way on windows to get this you might find folders from many programs that you thought you deleted or old viewers you thought you deleted but they live on in those old viewers files and current viewer files is you and any other account you use regadless what grid you call home unless you delete them,
        the way the viewers are set up while logged in secondlife that info of whothose accounts are is sent to the servers every log in to be documented
        so it is not impossable and more likely other grids have something set up just like this in some ways and completely legal under the TOS you agree to by logging into that grid

        AppDataRoaming folder .(easy way to find that would be going to my documents and put %appdata% in the searchbar).

        So long story short put motives away, is someone was doing this sort of thing then what tools or advantage’s are they using well likely they are intercepting private conversations using the pocket method, the other is if they can get you to visit the grid they are based out of then they can know what accounts you have including alts to monitor i cannot say enough how powerful this would make people who are up to no good, become it’s very dangerouse flaws unfixed,

        As an industry unregulated there is no enforcement branch or anyone else to safe watch this indusrty it is self policed,

        Who knows what motives people have, but is it possable to undermind a grid if that was a groups objective yes and how easy is it, well as easy as finding a copybot viewer another part of the system that has just as many flaws,

        Just a reminder i have responded with a civil view of my thoughts on this subject and would ask any responses be just as civil,

        Thank you for taking the time .

        • Wayfinder

          Are you claiming inworldz is harvesting residents private
          information from the viewer? or is your statement saying
          that its possible in general because of a great viewer flaw
          please clarify Mortus,
          Just as maria pointed out inworldz is the fastest most popular grid the facts ARE in the numbers so they most be doing something right! so please be consider thinking about inworldz honour before before posting what many know is rubbish.

        • 1. Fortunately, what you describe about intercepting IMs with a hacked viewer is not possible since the packets are sent only to the user in question. They are direct messages (DMs) because they go direct. They are not broadcast to the entire Internet for everyone to receive if they run a hacked viewer to remove a fictional “is this for me” check.

          2. There is no trawling of the AppData folders to get a list of users; there is a kind of optional recent users storage on the login form so that you don’t have to retype your username every time you start a viewer, but that’s not even based on the list of folders. The folders are for your own use, storing and recalling your IMs if you have logging on, and for storing your cache such as inventory, etc. None of that is sent to the servers, by any viewers, except with the knowledge of the user (such as when you attempt to log in). The InWorldz viewer is an open source project stored here: https://github.com/InWorldz-Viewer/InWorldz-Viewer Basically everything you said in the second point is possible for someone who has access to your local machine to see (like a spouse or family member), but not used by the viewer and certainly not accessible by any grid.

          I know of no management anywhere in any business with the strong moral fiber of the InWorldz folks. That’s why I have attached myself there, because they are such good, just, fair people. Please be careful how you speculate on what some other evil-minded persons *could* do versus what reputable management actually does. Although for the most part, what you’ve said above isn’t even technically possible.

        • I just want to point out that the above Mortus does not seem to have any visible account registered on InWorldz as I am the rightful registered owner of both Mortus Eclipse and Mortus Allen accounts on InWorldz. I have been a long time resident of InWorldz and a strong supporter.

          This posing and the above claims this morning as Elenia IMed me to rebut them. Needless to say I was quite confused as to why she would be IMing me about things I had never posted. As a long time resident and one who’s opinions are valued on the InWorldz forums as being level headed, I am not surprised one may try to use my name to spread misinformation.

          As far as my view on viewers is concerned many from the InWorldz forums know I am not in favour of using adapted viewer code developed for SecondLife or OpenGrid use, or the great efforts that have and are taken to support TPVs. This is not due to any security concerns, but rather due to the fact that is only serve to entrench legacy support and protocols, rather than freeing InWorldz to truly innovate on a grander scale.

          I do however understand that this may be needed in order to keep those migrating from other virtual worlds who may be entrenched with their TPV preferences comfortable will InWorldz is ready and able to gain the user base it needs outside of the current virtual world user community to risk loosing those that simply refuse to move forward.

          That being said, we in InWorldz do indeed have a much stronger and more rounded community. It needs improvement in certain areas certainly, but I think the numbers and trends speak for themselves.

          • Mortus

            I never claimed to be you as all manners aside before you claim someone is pretending to be you lets look at the facts shall we,

            My Disqus account has no last name
            My Discus account is not your picture
            The name is not one of a kind and used by others including me,
            your both not the only resident,
            It does not make a difference what the founders said or told you its up to you to take or believe it,

            Some of those who sent you to falsely correct me have a lot of nerve trying to single me out with this ridiculous spectacle of insecurity and self control because whatever is added by me anyplace besides the grid is my own business not for you or the founders to come here to correct me like a child and a paying one at that,

            ‘EDITED’ I felt the need to remove part of my comment as it was due to being flustered and the paragraph irrelevant

          • I see we have another full moon. Everyone tends to get a little crazy.
            Guys… I would not be particularly surprised to see another Jim somewhere in the world, even the online world. It happens. But at the same time, the “you people” makes no sense unless Mortus E has cloned himself. (Wait… he has! He has two Mortus accounts on IW!) 😀

            None of this name mixup is related to any grid any more than either of you should be upset at HyperGrid Business for the monthly grid stats. You have the same first name. You both opinions, you are two different people, and that’s clear now.

          • I’d like to add a quick note here for those who think I pick on InWorldz too much … I’ve been getting emails from other grid owners (you know who you are!) complaining about the fact that InWorldz is getting so much attention!

            And if you think you know of a great grid that isn’t showing up in these monthly reports, vote for it in our fourth annual OpenSim grid survey: http://www.hypergridbusiness.com/2013/11/fourth-annual-opensim-grid-survey/

            In the last two surveys, it was write-in candidates who did the best, and the first, Island Oasis, has already grown to be a top-ten grid by popularity!

            Lost Paradise, which did well last year, saw its traffic double for a few months, then go back to previous levels, possibly a sign that it’s not all that easy to scale up and still maintain a high level of performance and support.

            So if you’re user of a small grid that has that something special, please vote! Thanks!

          • Perhaps I spoke out of turn on the issue of identity. None the less it was clear that our identities regardless were being confused, and as such I had to speak on it. Especially given the false second hand information you were passing off.

            I think it should be more than clear that my support of InWorldz does not mean that I am a Founder fanboy, or that I except what they say out of hand. I have disagreed on a number of occasions with the Founders of InWorldz, but none of these are enough to withdraw my support. For every 1 thing I disagree with, there have been 5 that I agree with. Such is the nature of humanity.

          • Mortus

            Confused is your rationalization well I am a very forgiving type then we can just put that as water under the bridge between us shall we,

            As for false second hand information that is a true error on your part as this was further validated by someone today working on a current a 3rd party viewer as it is used by linden lab to ban more then one account but you can disagree that is fine but if you feel I am wrong maybe you sould research it and talk to a third party not connected to the grid,

            Well I responded to someone’s comment just like you that does not make anyone a criminal it just verifies we are individuals with an opinion,
            on behalf of the founders I apologize as surely they must feel the same way ,
            Best Regard’s to you Mortus Eclipse
            Goodbye everyone,
            ‘Mortus’

    • Vanish

      Interpunctuation. Makes your point come across since the invention of the comma.

    • Nick Zwart

      Douglas, this is serious or did you feel the need to make yourself rediculouzzz.
      Nick

    • Mortus

      Is it possible yes.

    • grimley

      Douglas, as a long time 3Dmee resident and region owner (and friend of the developer) I can assure you that you are wrong about them selling e-mails… it just never happened… If you have citations proving these claims then please post them, otherwise you look like a fool and a troll (if you are getting porn and scams in your e-mail I would look into your other web surfing activities before accusing someone falsely)

      As for the rest of your post, you come across as a conspiracy theorist, and nobody takes them seriously… once again, CITATIONS

  • AviWorlds

    AviWorlds is not a portuguese grid. It has a lot of brazilians in it who speak portuguese. Portuguese is the main lanquage in Brasil.
    Actually AviWorlds is from New York, Long Island, USA.

    • Vanish

      Do you really only come here to complain?

    • Alex — Hmm… your comment seems to have changed. You pointed out a mistake I made in describing AviWorlds as Portuguese. I thought that was the main language on the grid, but I’ve added English to my listing in my database, and have updated the story and took that description out.

  • Vanish

    “the Twitter feed looks like it’s been hijacked by a spammer for the past month”

    This made my day. Thanks.

  • Danko Whitfield

    I would bet the increase in users at InWiorldz is mainly a direct result of the TOS controversy in SL. There is certainly anecdotal evidence to support this, all around the blogosphere. I doubt any recent improvements at InWorldz have anything to do with it. The increase is much more likely to be previous improvements in InWorldz that had already made it a place that SLers would be attracted to, once they had a reason to shop around and see what other grids are out there.

    • That sounds reasonable. If I was an SL user or merchant looking for a second home as a backup, InWorldz offers land at a fraction of Second Life and the largest active community in OpenSim.

      I’d like to point out that this is good for ALL OpenSim grids. Once someone has made the jump to OpenSim — regardless of which grid they go to first — they’ve made the biggest step. They’ve learned how to use an OpenSim-compatible viewer and select a grid from it. Some of these folks are now going to get curious and explore the other grids out there.

      Any grid that brings in new users to OpenSim, whether those users are from SL, from their schools or companies, from local media ad buys, from outreach to online communities like book clubs or fan clubs — whatever their outreach strategy, if it exposes more people to this platform, it’s a good thing and they deserve to be lauded for it.

      • Absolutely, what is good for one grid is good for the whole industry. There is a huge percentage of SL users who would never ever try another grid. If InWorldz shows some of them that there are other choices, OpenSim will benefit in general. I used to work for a CEO who had a very strong sense of coopetition ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coopetition ) and learned it’s much better to work “compete” together in a positive way. I have my clear preference, but we’ll all grow if we show the user base that they have several good choices.

    • Arielle

      I would agree but I have to wonder then why Inworldz took in such a large percentage of migrating S/L’ers while the 2nd largest grid, Osgrid for example, actually lost. Inworldz of all the grids is the most expensive in terms of land costs and the most closed to hypergrid travel. The only advantage I could see is that they have a much higher user per region count then many of the other grids which should translate to better community and social interaction.
      Time will tell if it is just a temporary blip in the statistics or whether the LL ToS change will result in growth of Opensim as a whole.

      • Joe Builder

        The ToS change as many call it has been in place for some time now, Problem is no one really paid to much attention to reading it until lately, As we all know, There is no OAR’s nor is there IAR’s and LL been holding everyone’s assets for the longest. I think why they made changes to there ToS is because everyone and there brother where going to “I’ll take them to court route”. What they do like any other large corporation is cover there butts from the lechers is all.
        And Inworldz secret is they follow the SL formula to some extent, That is the trick.

      • I can think of a few reasons.

        First, when you’re comparing to $300 a month — and $1,000 setup fees — the difference between $25 that you would pay on OSgrid and $60 on InWorldz is pretty minor. Plus, you have to find a hosting company that serves OSgrid — there are plenty, but you have to shop around, compare management panels, etc… Setting up your own region at home for free is very difficult, especially if you have a router that needs configuring, so it’s not really an option for most people. With InWorldz, you just buy land from the grid. Easy, peasy.

        Second, InWorldz is a commercial social grid. It has paid staff working to support the community, promote events, promote merchants, and so on. OSgrid is a non-profit and while it doesn’t actively go around shutting down parties and stores, commercial activity is not particularly encouraged. And — despite grumbling about having to buy stuff all over again — most people actually like shopping. They enjoy the process of finding cool stuff and spending money. One of the advantages of living in a virtual world is that you can buy and buy and buy and get that nice shopping buzz and still not make much of a dent in your (real-world) wallet.

        Finally, InWorldz is busy. So when you ask random people for a recommendation about which grid to visit, they’re more likely to say InWorldz, because that’s where they spend their time. This creates a snowball effect. The hypergrid will — eventually — grow to the point where it will negate this effect, but we’re not nearly close to there yet, and many people still haven’t heard of hypergrid travel, don’t know how to do it, or are scared of it.

      • Guest

        OSG is only a TEST grid anyway.

        • Roger

          Don’t leave out that 90% of osgrid is full of copybotted stuff
          only a closed grid modeled after SL can offer that protection ..Always has been and Always will be peeps

          • Jason

            EPIC FAIL Bro!!!!!!!!!!! I’ll bet you never even stepped your perfect little feet in our grid you GRID RACIEST PIG!!

          • There is currently no way for any grid to prevent copybotted content from being uploaded (open or closed), without turning off uploads altogether.

            The only things that grids *can* do is remove infringing content once they learn about it, and block users who repeatedly upload infringing content.

            As far as I am aware, there is currently no grid that deliberately refuses to take down infringing content. It’s just too much of a legal liability. And that includes OSgrid.

            There is also no way, that I am aware of, for any grid to prevent copybotters from stealing stuff from that grid. Again, whether open or closed. The biggest source of copybotted content right now is Second Life, since that’s where most of the content is, the same way that bank robbers go after banks since that’s where the money is.

            Now, you might argue that some grids owners respond faster to takedown requests, or have a more streamlined process in place. Kitely, for example, has a nice form in place: http://www.kitely.com/copyright_notice

            Plus, they have a system where if someone uploads infringing content to the market, they will not only remove it, but also take back any money the thief earned by selling it. But Kitely is not much like a traditional closed grid. They allow full region exports, for example (with proprietary content filtered out) and will be enabling hypergrid travel soon (again, with filters in place for no-export items).

            My point here is that it’s not the fact that a grid is closed or open that protects content, but the efforts that grid managers make in policing it.

          • Joe Builder

            Just to add SL’s marketplace has very little or any copybotted items that would be extremely foolish. But what we need to look at is the Avatars, Most if not all copy the SL 3 textures to make there Opensim avatar look as they do in SL. Clothes is probably the biggest theft again its only a texture.

          • Arielle

            SL’s Marketplace very definitely has copybotted stuff on it and remember that there it is taking money out of S/L creators pockets whereas the minimal amount of copybotted items that exist on the free grids have not caused any loss since none sell to to those Grids in the first place. Majority of the easily accessable content on the free grids has been made by local creators though there is some older s/l content that was brought over legally back in the day when it was allowable. The newer content that some have brought over from S/L is rarely if ever distributed in-world, similar to what happens on the supposedly secure closed grids. Much of that sort of thing has been bought in S/L by the people who purchased the license in the first place.

            The people you are witch hunting for are those who actually copy content and then sell it to others and that is only relevant for Secondlife.

    • I think the ToS controversy is being overplayed by many people. In the case of everyone I’ve recently met migrating from SL, it was either the recent InWorldz feature additions, or a much longer-standing pent-up desire to explore outside SL, or both. Often the first stop for an alternative is InWorldz. These users aren’t necessarily moving, they are just exploring, adding to the worlds with which they want to become more familiar.

      I have been personally told that one very large group of creators that came from SL have been planning it for a very long time, just building a bit of momentum to actually log in and take action, and that the timing is completely coincidental with the SL ToS changes.

      Others have just been waiting for it to grow a bit more, and now as InWorldz approaches 90000 users, and a significant monthly unique visitor numbers, the threshold has been reached for more and more SL users. InWorldz is now “big enough”, and for some they feel they are missing out on the next big thing if they don’t check it out. It’s mostly word-of-mouth, so it has a natural snowball effect once the snowball gets big enough.

      Also, I think some people have been waiting to see if InWorldz could actually deliver on some of the big technical projects, such as replacing the scripting engine with a much better one, replacing the SQL inventory storage with a scalable NoSQL solution (Apache Cassandra), bringing PhysX-based physics to the world, and most recently a good LSL vehicle implementation that is very compatible with SL’s (even some of the faults are emulated). Other initiatives like Dreamshare and InShape to distinguish it from both SL and other grids. It’s all starting to add up for some folks, and the technical ones are spreading that word-of-mouth to the non-technical ones. I think the momentum has finally caught up and we’re seeing that now. Not just one thing like ToS changes, and not even anything SL-related.

      Unfortunately, there’s also a bit of a tendency for some people to try to smear whatever is popular at the time. I hope most readers will see through the rumor spreaders and recognize it’s not reality.

      • I should add that I am one of the people that completely exited SL after these ToS changes, but that shouldn’t surprise anyone (probably more of a surprise that I had any presence there still). And I think that sentiment of being angry and digusted at the careless changes will be found in many SL users. I would certainly advise content creators to remove their IP from SL, but I recognize that is just me being careful.

        However, I just think that as a percentage, the number of users it is tiny, even insignificant. LL knows this. When we see growth elsewhere, it probably won’t be directly related to the ToS changes.

        • You should also have added that you are employed by inwz.

          This is just an fyi kinda thing, it does not matter to me personally but others may like transparencies of this sort, who may not be aware of this factoid.

          • I’m very proud of that yes, but I don’t mention it in every posting (or then some would claim I’m advertising). I implied it in a message above, but yes, I am a server developer there, for 3.5 years. If you just hover the mouse over my picture and/or follow it and read my Disqus profile, it’s pretty transparent.

          • Yes, of course, but as some do read here [who also would not know how to or even think of it] and don’t know this, I just figured I would do my little fyi thang.

            As a brief response to some other things you are saying here.

            First, I would not take much value in the title of the articles here as indicating anything is particularly special about your grid…after all, she also mentioned in the title 3dmee is closing…lol

            She also did not use some of the titles some of us suggested last month [for which I have cried about]…my favorite was:

            OpenSim reaches new highs…wookie wowie weed to blame!!!

            Frankly, tbh, I have never had a problem with people who promote their own grids, especially if they gain something they think is important to them [neverminding that “importance” is a very relative word]..whether it be a few bucks a month selling something or being a paid programmer, or whatever.

            However, though I have to admit you are at least intelligent and know how to put sentences together well, elucidate your own opinions well, and spell properly, intelligence is never fully encompassing.

            In other words, you may, or may not be, a really good programmer, but that does not equate to you being common sense smart, if you [or anyone interested who is reading] can see my point.

            You mention [of course] what you feel are the strong points about the grid you work for, while leaving out critical transparencies, and I have seen this often enough in your proselytizing attempts to know this for a fact.

            Now, I do think you mean well. I also know you have some friends who speak highly of you, some of whom I know otherwise…all good.

            But implying that inwz is “all that” when most either do not care, or know better, is rather disingenuous [or just dumb] or simply shows you are not “intelligent” in that regard. I don’t really know as I do not know you personally.

            It is a fact, that though inwz seems to be finally catching up with the rest of the Meta, it does in fact lag behind in certain things. Whether or not they are of value to some folks, will be eventually seen.

            But continuing to say inwz is in some regards, better to the rest of the Meta, is incorrect.

            As to another point you tried to make, yes, many are using Bullet physics, some testing, some pushing the limits which all will help it to be even better.

            This guy does several things that it is unlikely your grid will ever do [nvm your expected comments about how they are kludges or whatever which is why inwz will not do them, that is opinion mostly].

            http://blog.ingen-lab.com/?p=10843

            He is currently experimenting with varregions, another step forward in an evolving opensim experience, along with mega regions and using Bullet.

            Bullet has been available as an option since, I think, 7.4 OS, and I read that 8.0 will have it on by default.

            Already, even in ODE, which your grid long ago turned off in most regards [due, I think, in your grid forking off at OS 6.5, but I do not have the tech reasons] [I recall regions crashing when someone from SL came in with physics scripts and tried to use them] has some awesome vehicles and boats and such.

            Not to mention just enabling mesh, which we all have had for some time now.

            As the paradigm is very different than the commercial type thing your grid does, nobody makes money and do it all for the love of it…which, to my thinking, is the absolutely coolest part of opensim.

            So when you say inwz is better or done this or that better than the rest of the Meta, it really just comes across as snake oil salesmen talk to those of us who know better.

            But, that’s fine, to each their own, and to each their own grid of choice [and to each their own reality] [or choices in many cases]…I am all for it.

            As to your saying inwz owners are somehow above reproach and honest brokers for their customers, that is just some kind of god complex you got going on. Nobody is that “good” especially when it comes to those who make a living doing such things. It reeks of sycophantism [is that a word??? I dunno]…but, please, such fawning is rather an embarrassing to see.

            Aside from some of us knowing better…[and no, I am not interested in getting into that old crap, and I won’t..feel free to do as you wish though-))]

            In any case, my main thing in this comment is to give folks a link to my new theme song!!!! enjoy!!!

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwHLJnLvBSQ

            ps, Nice to see ya watching Beth, and pulling the strings getting people over here to comment, such as Mortus [poor guy, tho I do not know him at all]..you havin’ fun???

          • When someone asks why is it that InWorldz has seen an increase in popularity, and someone else from another grid says there’s nothing special about InWorldz, I don’t think it’s a bad thing to point out some of the really incredible accomplishments. I know InWorldz isn’t the only grid to have achievements, but it is one of the subjects of this article, and the topic of that question. I know you don’t see it that way but I didn’t expect you to given your history of extreme bias.

            I don’t appreciate the personal attack either. Let me assure you that when you respond to reasonable comments by questioning the intelligence of the other person, it usually just shows your own. I can do without the patronizing. Do you have to turn everything into a battle of us vs them, and post such divisive comments.

            For the record, you can use L3DT (or any other raw file editor) in InWorldz too, and smooth terrain there. That’s not any kind of OpenSim innovation. There is even a simple function in InWorldz called iwSetGround which takes a rectangle area (e.g. the area under a sized prim) and sets the terrain to a specific flat height.

            I wish you well in whatever your favorite grid is. I wish you would learn to move on from your need to attack InWorldz with veiled accusations and inaccurate technical info every time you see it mentioned. The personal prods and insults won’t work on me; I really don’t care if you post insults under the guise of suggestions or whatever. And It doesn’t really do you or your favorite grid any service, or users in general.

          • I don’t have any favorite grid, and they all know that. I prefer grid hopping and enjoying the various interesting things people are doing with them…such as this one:

            https://plus.google.com/u/0/b/113904954583860050633/events/cfhjqs7lccfldg0q1c9c73n12qs?authkey=CKHYoM6C-Y7ywQE

            And, frankly, I have never considered you relevant enough to give much efforts to…that you think I am insulting you really only shows you think way to much of yourself, and should probably develop a bit of humility and hubris.

            As well, any of your facile attempts to insult me, and those like me with similar silly attempts to denigrate us and our opinions, only serves to show astute watchers the kind of people who run that grid….which I do always appreciate.

            Bringing up old news and incorrectly stating my stance on things just shows you are so one-sided that it is ridiculous.

            And rather than answer to the real questions, you show an evasion technique that is most obvious.

            I never cared what you thought of me, you do not matter at all, you have showed yourself to be a simple one-sided parochial shill one to many times, even bringing your drama into another grid’s own forums.

            Nothing I have ever said to you was a personal attack but simply trying to point out to the watchers what you do, and your answers always make that even clearer in how you folx think it is ok to treat past customers who have moved on to better things, in such low regards, and never answer to direct questions.

            In other words, you sink to the lowest common denominator rather than attempt to attain a higher stature.

            Frankly, the only reason I even speak directly to you is to pass time-))

            Get real Jim, you are only a legend in your own mind…take some advice and chill a bit, smoke a good joint, or take a tab of LSD or somethin’…

            here is another fun flick I am watching atm:

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLB3mK_t9kE

          • Mine, the patronizing insults in your last two comments and attempts to divert attention don’t deserve a substantive reply. They don’t do anyone any service. We’re done.

          • Actually, when one uses the word patronizing to another, it is with a feeling of superiority, they, themselves, have.

            I would never feel superior to anyone and neither, in return, should anyone feel superior to me [well, ok, unless they really, really are]. I also never use that word.

            “pa·tron·ize

            treat with an apparent kindness that betrays a feeling of superiority.

            ““She’s a good-hearted girl,” he said in a patronizing voice”

            synonyms:treat condescendingly, condescend to, look down on, talk down to,put down, treat like a child, treat with disdain”

            My first comment to you was actually me being nice, I even added some, admittedly, small attempts at joking to try to lighten it up….considering where I always know any attempts to talk to you inwz lovers goes, I thought it was very reasoned.

            The second was in no way much of an attempt to hide my disdain of such comments as you, of course, responded with. I could have been more subtle, and you may likely not have seen it, but I felt a more obvious approach was needed. Still, I was nice [ok, nicer than I could have been, give me a break will ya!!]. That you think I was not shows some interesting negative traits you have.

            If I was really wanting to have some fun with ya I would have used an old phrase a girlfriend used in a BBS I was in quite a few years back. She said:

            “Let me tie one-half of my brain behind my back to we can be on more equal terms”…silly, I know, I have never actually used that one, but I remember it was so funny when she said it-))

            And you still didn’t say if you liked my new theme song of the superman fan movie…gosh

            And, we are not finished due to the fact we never actually started. And now I am tired….

          • Joe Builder

            Keep up the good work, Seems the problem is many don’t like to see other grids other than there own succeed. As the stats show time and time again, Inworldz has been doing a superb job. Jealousy is a ugly thing, Made by ugly people.

          • I’d like to add that there are some other, proxy measures, that people can use to evaluate how busy a grid is:
            * Activity on its forums
            * Its event schedule
            * Activity on social media
            * Activity on grid-related blogs
            * Third party surveys (hint: vote now!)

            By all these measures, InWorldz is doing extremely well.

            If we had a grid that advertised a lot of users, but had no in-world activity, events, blogs, social media mentions, etc.. then I’d be very, very suspicious. (And I’m not going to name names, but I’ve seen this happen, and have dropped those grids’ stats from my reports.)

          • Roger

            That’s what it is jealousy because we have smart business people running the show that know better then use freeware
            or allow giefers or perverted adults activity’s.. in a nutshell we keep the grid clean by being friendly to everyone that’s the secret (shhh)

          • Joe Builder

            Wow all this ranting from many sides, Its very simple to see by the numbers (stats) Inworldz takes the prize regardless what scripting language they use. Ode is done, no more development, Bullet is no where near ready for release only testing. And lord knows if its even gonna fit the bill. So yes Inworldz hands down. Osgrid is a test grid only in a category all by itself. many get that confused, and don’t knock what butters your bread. Anyways that’s it not a long story that has no meaning, Proof is in the numbers some can read them and weep, it is what it is.

      • Mindy from Osgrid

        Jim your late to the party.

        Jim wrote ‘PhysX-based physics to the world, and most recently a good LSL vehicle implementation that is very compatible with SL’s (even some of the faults are emulated’
        We have had bullet physics for awhile now developed by Intel
        ‘the billion dollar lab’ also we have had mesh for years.other grids like avination have had a custom LSL fully compatible full physics custom scripted engine for a few years including vehicle scripts.
        Lets not forget Aurura based sims with a ton of innovative features
        that includes advanced scripting and full LSL/OSLSL Compatible vehicle physics a complete special physics engine for several years

        Jim wrote ‘replacing the SQL inventory storage with a scalable NoSQL solution (Apache Cassandra),’
        We have our own back ups in opensim so we are not dependent on anyone else , also grids are going to a permission system to allow opensim for creators so best of both worlds.

        Jim wrote ‘Other initiatives like Dreamshare and InShape to distinguish it from both SL and other grids.’
        That’s very nice that you offer those and in time you will know how effective they are,
        We have Innovative grids ourselves with each one offering something special that no other grids have plus we have hypergates that enables us to have more freedom with enhanced community.
        As for the Second Life well they change TOS often its nothing new
        plus every time LL makes any changes it often leads to the same old thing every time ‘the sky is coming down, it is falling’ but in a few months it will be forgotten but I suspect most everyone in OS is tired of hearing the linden bashing its so 2008 plus it hurts us more then helps.

        • I agree completely with your last paragraph. That’s why I commented later that I didn’t think there was any real connection between the ToS changes and InWorldz recent numbers. I think a big part of the monthlies was as David (founder) mentioned: the big Relay For Life events, and other Halloween events. It’s a big time of the year for virtual worlds. I wouldn’t be surprised to see the numbers decline a bit after that, and also as the autumn lull goes into full force. We shouldn’t read too much into the monthly variations, but rather look at numbers year to year.

          I don’t think it’s bashing to talk about the positive things your favorite grid has. Bashing is being negative about another grid, like when you said IW was late to the party. When I talk about what InWorldz has, it’s to mention the positive things being accomplished. When Bullet is deployed as the default on OpenSim grids, that will be a major accomplishment there too, because I don’t think anyone would disagree that ODE physics has long needed a replacement. And it’s coming and that’s a very good thing. Is Bullet running on any of the big grids yet? I’d love to give some Bullet-based vehicles a spin to see how much better than ODE it is. Yes, that’s a very positive step forward for OpenSim.

          I have to disagree that there is anything like the Phlox script engine out there though. Phlox is a virtual machine host that does not compile code to MONO/.NET DLLs that runs as native code (same level as the region server code itself). That’s not a good model for performance, and one reason why LL has to blame scripters for poor performance. If a grid is saying something is a bad script, then that’s passing the buck. They should fix that case so that such a script cannot have that effect. That’s what we do under the Phlox script engine. It’s also really really fast. Hundreds of times faster than SL’s engine. That’s not bashing SL.

          The stuff about backups has nothing to do with making your inventory system scalable. But this isn’t really a good forum to debate the technical aspects of one approach vs. the other.

          I honestly think OpenSim is getting some good fixes and improvements lately and hope to see OpenSim-based grids grow greatly in coming years.

      • Mindy from Osgrid

        90000 that is good numbers jim
        can you tell us the amount of log in time each one does and for how long , how many of those are active since in last 30 days and how many have not logged in for 6 months to a year ?
        I would like to see an industry standard where the stats accepted by all but also maintained by a third party maybe with a module
        that would ensure honesty from all party’s .
        Jim will inworldz be the leader on this kind of project ?

        • The active monthly numbers are in fact in the article above, and the basis for the headline. And yes they are very good this month… but probably just a monthly fluctuation resulting from the things David mentioned in the article, not necessarily a short-term trend. I think it bodes well for the longer-term trend though (annual).

          I know that some work has been done to add additional stats, but I’m not sure what the status of that is yet. Some of the planned stats included session lengths and online time, yes. I’m not really familiar with exactly what stats are planned. I don’t think it’s practical to have some third-party “maintain” the numbers as they are logins to very secure servers at the Rackspace datacenter in Chicago. There’s no real way for a third-party to validate numbers unless they had database access to the private data of users and there’s no way InWorldz would ever allow that to be violated that way. It’s not realistic to mistrust the numbers coming from every grid and try to hook a third-party. That could always be faked if a grid was mischievous and immoral enough for that. Fortunately, most if not all of the larger grids have strong character and want the numbers to be real.

  • Vanish

    Re: SpotOn3D patents, I think I can provide some insight. http://v.tgib.co.uk/2013/11/16/the-spoton3d-opensim-patents/

  • ok, now this is weird. Munch on this folx.

    I have not been in the inwz grid since February. I forgot to turn off offlines which I still sometimes get, but this is separate. How the heck can a grid find prims from a region that has been gone over, like, 2 years ago, from a job I had there, on another region that I have never even heard of??? strange stuff in these virtual worlds we travel in…

    Minethere Always, you have received
    an offline message from Server!

    November 20, 2013, 6:07 am

    Your object Portugal Flag and Flag
    Pole was returned from in region Xocotora due to parcel auto
    return

    • Harry

      I had a region in Iwz it was closed in 2012 went i back 8 months in 2013 my region was still intact showing me as the owner then 4 months later it was still online but had been moved to some very distant part of the grid with around 200 regions at first i thought they just kept the name while building a mainland but no the region was still in my name even in my account dashboard, but strange all together but i went on to VH highway grid
      its nice with great support but lately a lot of drama from people saying they had quit Iwz but then have asked me in private what it would take to get me to return to Iwz?, i might just have to change names as why would i go back nothings changed its same lady founder with upper class and lower class residents if that’s not true then they would have kicked out elf clan long ago instead they allow that guy to run amuck forcing out anyone they do not like,
      Just FYI he called my friend an Aids Infested Dyke who god had punished as a sinner that is why i left forever that is a dangerous place to be social
      and i beg anyone to consider any other grid but that one as no one sould reward that kind of behavior not now or ever.

      • I hear ya, I actually suspect region padding goes on in some commercial grids, but I have no proof of course, and, frankly, I no longer have any interests in grid numbers anymore anyways…they can to easily be made to show whatever a grid wishes them to show…none of that matters though.

        Total grid numbers have some probative value in seeing trends, but individual ones are just for those who like such things, mostly to use in promoting their favorite grid atm.

        The real issue you speak to about drama is a rather serious problem, and some I know have in fact changed their names due to it. I never have, as I like to stand behind my avie name, but others are not that way, and cause all sorts of issues.

        Now, if you really wish to get away from the drama associated with most [but not all, of course] commercial grids, go figure out free opensim, you could check into Metropolis, for example:

        http://www.hypergrid.org/metropolis/wiki/en/index.php/Hauptseite

        From there you can learn to use the hypergates and see where the vast majority of people using virtual worlds have gone [other than sl of course]. Non-commercial and very cool.

        Or figure out how to contact me or read my disqus to see about other options-))

      • Joe Builder

        Harry really sorry to hear you had a bad experience in a grid, The problem is we all deal with the internet which in fact isn’t a perfect science. What works for some may in fact may not work great for others. So there is options, 1 would be go to another grid. Rather than say everyone stay away for one particular grid, being you had a bad experience. There is always 2 sides to every story

    • Mine, just to let you know, it’s very normal for this to happen, especially if you’ve ever rezzed something on a mainland region. Mainland regions get reclaimed when someone gives one up, and then later someone else buys it and it is reused. In other cases, regions may be renamed or moved depending on the new owner’s wishes. In fact Xocotora is one of the many regions Biker now owns on the mainland.

      Also, it’s definitely possible for prims in objects rezzed to be ignored for a very long time, especially if they fit the environment. In this case a flag pole and flag? That sounds reasonable that it may not be returned for a very long time, especially on a mainland region. I checked, and auto-return is indeed now enabled in that parcel where the flag pole was.

      If you want, it can be arranged for all remaining items owned by you to be returned now so that this never happens again.

      • Yes, I thought as much, but it was kinda weird to me. Apparently some others have also had similar kinds of issues as some have been posting about in your forums.

        Actually, I would love to have everything I put in your grid removed or returned, whichever is easier. As I know this can be easily done, I do appreciate the offer. I keep getting returns in other regards over time and was just about to just filter all inworldz email to my junk folder…this would be much better.

        Even more, I would love you folx to implement the dead avatars things that sl does, that has been mentioned in your forums several times over the years…I don’t know the technical side of that but it has to do with maintaining UUIDs for those who bought stuff while also removing the avie, and their name, to the side of the main accounts.

        I have no need for that account so anything you all wish to do is fine with me. Thanks-))

        • I took a quick look and it seems there are hundreds of prims in-world that are still in use, so it’s not really appropriate for a grid-wide nuke of your prims. For example there’s a waterfall owned by you as part of the landscaping in Courchevel near 153/213/36. You also have a gestures box vendor thing at Wild Spirit near 40/52/24. That kind of cleanup is something for you or the landowner to clean up if desired, as we don’t want to be nuking parts of people’s builds. But you may get the occasional notification later from the land owners who may eventually decide to return the items you’ve put out. Or not, if they like them there, as in the case of the waterfall. 😉

          • Well, darn…lol…I keep getting returns over time and figured most were gone. Yea, Pari had me put that box there. I don’t recall the waterfall. Oh well, I will just do my own email filter, thx for checking….and the public comments…lol

    • Arielle

      Oh and here I thought you were a Metro-Girl. 🙂

      • lol…I am that, also, Arielle-))) I find Kitely interesting.